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VL Fuel Pump/s (x2) ???

GRPAVL

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I had a stall issue the other day and are thinking it is the fuel pump. When I went to look at it there is an external and some wires runnign inside the tank as well. Do they run an internal pump as well?

why do they run two pumps?

to me there is no surge and it simply appears that the pumps are inline so is it like a lifter or something?

I have changed to a 304 v8 from a VN. Do I really still need 2 pumps or can I do away with the internal and just run an external?

Help

Q
 
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VR38

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Internal pump is a low pressure lift pump used to continually prime the external high pressure pump.

If the internal pump is not functioning then the external pump will starve.
 

VR38

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Is that masia red on the VL in the avatar?
It looks smoking hot.
 

VR38

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You could change to a VP and on internal high pressure pump but never done the conversion myself.

They do look the same size tho.
 

07GTS

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the vl only needs the lift pump because the external pump is above the tank, if u had the main single pump in the tank then that would be fine...
 

Jxfwsf

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*edit* The low pressure VL (VN/VP long range tank etc etc) internal pump is different to the standard in tank VN-VS pump, it's shorter and looking at the 2 sender units it sits slightly higher off the bottom of the tank than the later model ones, you can't put a VN-VS pump into a vl sender for a single pump setup.

VLVNsender_zps7fd9e6f2.jpg

VN top, VL bottom, apart from fuel pump size the electrical connections differ.

Now you can use a VN sender unit with the single pump and convert the system easily, the external plugs are the same (also shared with VP but some VP's have the return line in the sender as per below)

Some VP/VR/VS sender units will work but they need to be the short ones as there is a longer variant that has the distance from the pump and the plate longer as they will not sit the pump in the swirl pot, keep in mind they also have the return line as part of this that will need to be blocked and if going VR/VS have different external plugs.


I've used an external VL fuel pump on a few occasions to drain tanks with them sitting on the ground and the hose going up to the filler and back down to the tank, they have enough suction power, i'm still unsure why they had to use 2 pumps, using an external pump is so much better when it comes to fixing a dead one, personally i'd go for a good quality rebuildable external pump and just put a sock filter and a piece of metal fuel line in place of the internal pump anyday...... quick ebay search, for $200-$300 you can get something like this (if you like quality, otherwise i'm sure there are cheaper options or if like myself you tend to drive these earlier models due to being cheap runabouts and can keep the good bits and pass it onto the next cheap shitter for reliability) and when it shits itself you can shove a $50 rebuild kit through it repeatedly, if you're cheap then this isn't the option for you but if you hate having to drain tanks and stink of petrol each time you need to replace one on a car you plan to own for a long time......
 
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GRPAVL

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Thanks for confirming my fears guys.
I dont know why Holden used a lifter pump myself. I have run a vl pump above the fuel tank previously in a 200hp 1600cc race car I used to own and it never had any suction issues from the tank. (eventually I installed a surge and lifter but that was engine longevity)

JXW
Im thinking the lifter pump is the issue myself. It would explain the odd miss that I have while driving, if its not feeding enough to the main pump then the main pump cant supply the engine, and miss, cough splutter die.

Option 1
Rather than pull mine apart I might shoot down to the local pick apart and rip one out for comparison purposes (pending they have a vl of course).
I would prefer the option of one fuel pump only myself (either external or internal).

Option 2
Fit surge tank. Leave the internal lifter in place and feed to the top of the surge pot, from the bottom of the surge run to the high pressure external to the engine and back to the top of the surge pot, finally the top fitting would feed any excess to the tank again. Well thats what I had for the race car anyways.
In this fashion the surge is always full even if the lifter isnt working 100%. But I dont know if I can be bothered going to that extent.

Pick apart here I come.
 

GRPAVL

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In the end I decided to use an internal VR/VS 3.8L V6 pump and adapt the VR/VS bracket to fit the vl tube section. I also took the wiring harness section to connect it all up internally once its completed. Shouldnt take to much more work (infact ive done 90% myself today and just need someone to weld the bracket now before I can test :)

I hope the VR/VS pump will work on a stock 308, I figure it should as the 3.8L makes more power than the stock RB30 did.

Updated with pics on my project page
http://forums.justcommodores.com.au/vl/219872-qs-1987-vl-calais-walkinshaw-project-20.html

Q
 

Jxfwsf

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If the VR/VS one you got is the short version it'll bolt straight in, just need to block the return line pipe and adapt the wiring.
Will check part numbers when i'm shopping for other parts tomorrow, fairly certain the v6 & v8 internal pump is the same.
 

Immortality

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Standard V6 internal pump is good for 200rwkw + much easier and simpler in my opinion.
 
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